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Post by Elena Rossini 🌈

Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

The journey of tech empowerment and liberation from tech bros can be a long, bumpy road.

The biggest tech regret of my adult life is that I didn't use a custom domain name as my main email address, so that when things invariably go south, I can simply hop to a new email provider.

The hundred or so email aliases I made with #Proton are a real headache right now. Time to clean up my mess.

What am I talking about? This ICYMI: 404media.co/manifestos-fear-an

#NoAI #enshittification #ProtonMail

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Replies

Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

I'm devastated to hear that #Proton 's CEO and CTO are treating their engineers in a terrible way, blindly trusting LLMs and creating a toxic culture where speed and growth trump security.

I'm not ready to make a radical switch yet but some little actions I implemented today could be useful for others, too:
1) I made my custom domain the DEFAULT email address in ProtonMail
2) I created aliases w my custom domain for shopping, newsletters, admin, etc.

Hoping this will make a transition smoother

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Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

My new approach vis-à-vis transitioning away from #Proton (in a slow way) - cont':

For every new email that comes in that uses one of my Proton email addresses (or aliases), I am making changes, updating the email address for that account (if it's shopping/newsletter/admin) or I am notifying the sender that going forward my default email address will be the one associated to my domain name.

It's a pain, but it's long overdue.

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Fairness4All @closeted_unionist@mastodon.social

@_elena I find it ironic proton fight big tech by using big tech (ie claude). Any alternatives? I was hoping for proton to be a more viable alternative to gsuite

Edit: typo

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Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

@closeted_unionist huh I do not use Claude. I picked ProtonMail 6 years ago because of its reputation for security and privacy and moved there from Google. I did not expect the company to take such a turn (in 2020 LLMs were not a thing)

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Andy Carolan @andycarolan@social.lol

@_elena Yeah, I'm so thankful that I picked my Domain for my main email addresses. So nice to be able to change provider if the one I'm using chooses the dark side.

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Sebastian @sebastian@mastodon.com.pl

@_elena so many aliases! I have much more less and consider, what should I do. Maybe can you share yours ideas how to resolve it?

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Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

@sebastian so I read reports by people who used a free account for a month and then did not pay that aliases ALLEGEDLY still work, even when plans expire. Still, I want to create a personal system where I do not rely on one big company for such a key feature.

I'm happy I never used ProtonDrive and ProtonPass, that's for sure.

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Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

@paulk totally understand, ESPECIALLY for something as sensitive as passwords. They've lost my trust... the only way forward for them is to fire Andy Yen AND their AI-pilled CTO. This is catastrophic for their image and reputation, I don't see any other way to recover

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Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

@ngel I'm waiting to see how Proton reacts to this catastrophic, reputation-destroying story. If Yen and the AI-pilled CTO step down, I may consider sticking around. My unlimited plan renews in May.

For the time being I am changing my "from" email address and using a custom domain name to make the transition easier... I'm also looking at Tuta (where I already have an account)

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Andrea @andresti@livellosegreto.it

@_elena Oh wow, just in time, I was about to switch everything over to a Proton email these next few days, that was a close one😅

I have a few questions about the custom domain thing since I'm pretty new to this. How does it work if I need to switch providers using my custom domain email? If I were to switch, does it also move all my saved emails/folders/labels over to the new provider? What providers would you recommend?

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Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

@andresti if you switch to a new provider you still need to backup / download all your old emails but you won’t have to write to all your contacts to notify them of the change or tweak anything… just change DNS settings (with a couple of hours to propagate the change)

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Petra van Cronenburg @NatureMC@mastodon.online

@_elena "so many aliases" ... joke aside: Every time, I want to recommend you here and don't remember your whole name (I'm bad with names), I type @ plus part of your name ... and suddenly the Mastodon automatic completion for accounts runs wild. Too many accounts wirh your name. 😆

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Elisabetta @gilraen79@mastodon.social

@_elena when I was starting my degoogled life this year I had to choose between Proton and Tuta: I am glad I chose the latter, and I do hope that they don't turn out as evil as Proton's CEO did. So far I'm loving Tuta, I hope you join them or find a new, reliable provider soon 😊

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Elisabetta @gilraen79@mastodon.social

@wonkothesane @_elena I have seen their replies and people's reactions to them, but I honestly want to believe they will listen to their customers' concerns and rethink about using AI for developing their services. I have always seen them listening to people, while Proton has always been shady to me, so I hope that was just a misstep. We will see in the next months, I suppose.

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Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

@gilraen79 @wonkothesane as far as I can tell, Tuta's company culture appears to be healthier than Proton's. I already have a Tuta (free) account and I have made my custom domain the default in Proton. Slowly preparing for a possible switch... but TBH if Yen and the AI-pilled CTO step down I may stick around. Reading between the lines it seems that Proton devs and engineers put an emphasis on human code, slowness, and prudence

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Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

@wonkothesane @gilraen79 what makes me really nervous about Proton is (1) how more importance is given to LLMs' coding vs. humans when it comes to security (2) the toxic culture created by AI-pilled management.

It's not just a blanket rejection of AI, it's more nuanced than that. I would trust a real life engineer with qualms and a desire to be prudent over management that pushes speed and genAI code.

I think alternatives to Proton may have better corporate culture... the bar is pretty low

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Svavar the Neurozesty @svavar@masto.svavar.com

@_elena

I’ve had a custom domain for my main email since 2004 with unique email addresses for every single website without fail.

It removes a huge amount of spam and fraudulent emails and shows exactly who’s been breached.

I can’t imagine doing email any other way and being able to transparently switch providers has been huge.

It’s never too late. I hope you find a domain you like and can live with.

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Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

@svavar thank you Svavar. I've had a custom domain (for my website) for 15 years. I regret not using it as my default email address, sigh. It's already connected to Proton, so I set it as my default mailing address and created a bunch of aliases (for shopping, newsletters, etc.) as I get ready - at a slow pace - to possibly make a switch... number one lesson to impart to my 5-year-old (I bought her a domain name when she was a month old)

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Leo Ré Jorge @LeoRJorge@mastodon.social

@_elena do you have any links that could work as a gateway to figuring out how to acquire and set up a custom email domain? I've been using the same Gmail address for 20 years and it's the major thing I haven't degoogled yet. I don't want to have to change it more than once, and by the looks of things I won't ever be able to trust any email provider.

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Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

@TerryHancock I'm just using my domain name as my default email address so I can freely switch providers in just a few clicks (and DNS changes). I am not self-hosting my email, I heard it's like a cartel and I don't want to worry about deliverability rates, etc. Just using my custom domain so I can hop between different providers, that's all

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Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

@BroBot90001 @tobias @TerryHancock @doncow sadly I think that AI code is pretty much everywhere now (look at Linux). My main problem with Proton is how the C-suite has created a toxic company culture, where legitimate concerns by software engineers are not acknowledged... on the contrary, there is bullying and name calling coming from the CEO. Unacceptable. I do not trust Proton anymore because they give more importance to AI than careful, handwritten code and want speed and scale at all costs

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Alastair Temple @smilingdemon@mastodon.art

@_elena this is something I need to do (and tbh have been meaning to do) with my Gmail for years... but haven't got round to because of the pain of the transition and difficulty in figuring out where to go.

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Ærion @aerion@nerdculture.de

@_elena
HO.LY. F.U.C.K.

Thanks for posting that link. I had absolutely no idea! I've been with #Proton for many years, 𝘱𝘳𝘦𝘤𝘪𝘴𝘦𝘭𝘺 because I want to get away from Big Tech, not to get dragged back in via the backdoor.

What a arrogant, dismissive prick, this guy. I feel sorry for the employees, but I'm gonna have to look for an alternative. It really suck, as Proton Meet and SimpleLogin are really good products. What a nightmare! 😱

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Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

@aerion it's a real nightmare, indeed. I moved to Proton 6 years ago in an effort to DeGooglify. This development has been really upsetting.

Honestly if they get rid of their CEO and the CTO I may stick around... it seems that engineers have their heart in the right place, putting an emphasis on hand-written code and caution.

Otherwise my paid plan lasts for another 6 months and I will slowly transition away from it.

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Walt Baldwin @waltbaldwin@mastodon.energy

@_elena

'In a follow-up message, Yen reiterated his point: “only losers think like that.” His ultimate message for the team was to “stop lovingly handcrafting all our code and use AI more.”'

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Sean @seanm@infosec.exchange

@_elena I've kept my SimpleLogin account separate from my Proton account for this possibility. Were you using the built-in alias functionality or a separate alias solution? I haven't tried to migrate, yet, but I'm hoping the separation does still exist for and I can just point my aliased addresses at a new mailbox.

I'm also probably going to look into a different email alias provider, because SimpleLogin is owned by Proton.

If/when I do migrate off of Proton, I'll likely use this as an opportunity to use my own registered domain, too. I still want to use a generalized alias email domain but having a custom domain for my personal email would be good.

#Proton #ProtonAG #AndyYen #SimpleLogin #AISlop #Privacy #Security

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Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

@seanm "luckily" I created all my aliases inside ProtonMail - so they should last even after (if) I cancel my plan. It's a shame that SimpleLogin is owned by Proton, I don't know of any other good alternatives and I LOVED the Dark Web Monitoring, sigh

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ティージェーグレェ @teajaygrey@snac.bsd.cafe
I am, almost surprised to read that you, on your self hosting journey, were not also self hosting email!

Then again, I probably began on the self hosting journey so long ago that it was more of a collaborative hosting (because computer resources were scarce and expensive and so BBSes and such were doing out best to share them with others) era (my first Internet accessible email address was UUCP, not SMTP; and I had other email systems in use before that too!)? So the bygone days of when sendmail had "wiz" and spam was not yet a reality? I miss.

At some point, I had been getting paid to run mailservers for employers for so long, I had more or less given up on it for personal use and let others with their free tiers handle that sort of thing.

Distressingly, it seems as if the free tiers of companies, can no longer be trusted as most have fallen prey to the realms of surveillance capitalism, so I too am in the process of going back to some sort of self hosted paradigm, for email of all things!?

I should have hoped by 2026, we would have all long since migrated to realtime end-to-end encrypted communications systems with Perfect Forward Secrecy and naturally, libre/free open source software implementations such as SILC; yet it seems as if the popularity of that fell by the wayside as the hegemonic powers that be foisted their bassackwardsness on the world? I know better is possible, since I already was using better contentedly, long ago.

These days? The "S" in SMTP, no longer seems meaningful; such a pity.

I am certain that you can take your self hosting lessons to the realms of email and be OK with it. Administering MTAs (Mail Transfer Agents) isn't the worst thing in the world; personally I prefer Postfix to sendmail; yet qmail presumably still functions? There are also OpenSMTPD from the OpenBSD developers now, and newer "gee-whiz" sorts of all-in-one thingamajiggers e.g. https://www.xmox.nl and https://stalw.art (the latter of which I am least familiar with and also seems to perhaps utilize LLMs to some degree?) which maybe also include calendaring and IMAP, etc. support?

Good luck on your continuing journey! Even as I, probably need to go back to some areas with which I was once all too well versed and apparently have let lapse in the intermediary years hoping that we may have moved on from such things, like the joke:

"Could you fax over a copy?"
"No, I can't fax because of where I live."
"Where do you live?"
"The 21st century."

To me at least? A good new technology, does not cling to the past.

So, any "web" service, still requesting an email address? IMHO, is not a good one.

SILC, did not require an email address.

Contrast with, e.g. Signal, which requires a phone number?

Even worse. At least email addresses (e.g. SMTP) have a multiplicity of libre/free open source implementations and that will presumably, always be true. Attempting to get phone numbers (sure there are projects such as OpenBTS, Asterisk, which provide VoIP functionality, yet they are the minority; the telephony realms are predominantly still promulgated by an entrenched, convicted monopoly). Based on that alone Signal use should be discouraged. Alas, there are many other good reasons to discourage usage of Signal.
Mox: modern, secure, all-in-one mail server

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Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

@teajaygrey I have read so many accounts of people struggling with self-hosting email - I think they compared this to a drug cartel - that I prefer to rely on paid email services and not have to worry about deliverability, server management, etc.

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ティージェーグレェ @teajaygrey@snac.bsd.cafe
I have faith in you! Admittedly, I know you already are doing a lot too. If and when you embark on that journey? My guess is: you will share your experiences, and others will learn a lot in the process and maybe I am overly optimistic? I suspect that it may inspire more to free themselves from the paid providers too.

No rush though; as I wrote previously; I am not presently being paid to administer others' systems and I don't have any gear racked anywhere of my own as well. Just because I have done such things in the past, doesn't mean that I am claiming it is easy for others or even myself at the present moment. I know it can be done, having done so repeatedly, and am confident that it is not beyond your, nor many others' skills.

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Elena Rossini 🌈 @_elena@mastodon.social

@teajaygrey infinite respect for people who self-host their own email but I have zero interest in doing that. I'd rather associate my custom domain to a secure, encrypted email service and not worry about anything.

I self-host a lot of things but for example I decided to use #MagicPages for my Ghost blog and I am so grateful for Jannis' work. I don't have to stress about maintenance etc.

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